I.I ! Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 1 McQueen: Too bad you couldn't a got Marge ••••••• across the street. IA: We're gonna see her this afternoon. MCQueen: I know, that's what she said. IB: IA: IB: IA: This is Shirley Bradley and Lisa Fine. We're at the home of Mabel McQueen and this is June, what's the date today? 16th. June 16, 1992 and we're going to be talking about Reo memories. The, this is just a biographical information form so that we Okay. get some background about you, some biographical information about where you grew up and where you were born and things that give us some contacts for you work records at Reo. So if, were you, were you born in the Lansing area? MCQueen: Urn, hum, in Okemos. IA: In Okemos, when it was still farms, right? McQueen: Yeah, that was a long time ago. IA: Is that what your parents did, were they farmers there? farm or ••• Did they McQueen: My dad worked at the college. IA: Oh, he worked at MSU? Oh. MCQueen: He worked there then and then he \'lentto farming in the Lansing area and then he went back to work at the college. He was a grounds •••••••••••• Worked there for many years. IA: McQueen: And your mom was at home, did she help at home? Urn, hum, .......... housewife • IA: Did you have, which was a very big job in and of itself. McQueen: Yes, back then. IA: Did you have a lot of brothers and sisters? McQueen: I had two brothers and one sister • IA: Okay. Did you go to school in Okemos? • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 2 McQueen: No, no, we moved away from there before I started school. I went to school at, when I started school, was a Horsebrook(?) School out at Delta. IA: IB: IA: Oh, I'm not familiar with that school, are you? Oh, the Delta Mills area. What was the name of the school? McQueen: Horsebrook. IA: Horsebrook? And that was ••• McQueen: It was right at the end of Delta River Drive there in ••• IB: In Clinton or something? MCQueen: No, no, this was Delta River Drive and Grand River. IS: Oh, okay. McQueen: We lived on Delta River Drive. IB: You did? McQueen: See, the school, the school, the school now is on the north side of Grand River and it used to be, when I started school, of course, it was a one room school and it was on the south side. IS: South side? MCQueen: Um, huh, just east of Delta River. IB: I know where it is, where Delta, if you're going down Oh, okay. Grand River, Delta River Drive angles off like that and it would be on the, just before you angle off on the Delta River. building, there's still a ••• Yeah, the McQueen: There isn't anything there where the school was. IB: Where the original school was. MCQueen: Sut see, they built a school across the street, later. IS: And I think that building is still standing. MCQueen: Oh, yes, ah, huh. IS: I'd forgotten about that school. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 3 IA: How come your parents moved from Okemos out here, to that area? MCQueen: Well, I guess, farm••• IA: Oh, they were farming then, too? MCQueen: Ah, huh, and then, they had a farm. IA: So he had a better, got a better •••••••••••••• and did you go to high school there too? MCQueen: No, I went to high school in Lansing at Eastern, Walter French and Eastern. I went to school at Maple Grove. See, after we left there, we moved over on Miller Road and IA: They weren't farming there, then? McQueen: Yes, ah, huh. IA: They were still? Wow. McQueen: And they moved to another farm. IS: Used to be all country around Lansing. MCQueen: Oh, yeah. 18: It's all subdivisions now. • MCQueen: Yeah, there on Miller Road it's all townhouses now where, on the farm we had. Isn't that amazing. So your parents can farm and you could still go to a city school. IS: IA: McQueen: Well, it wasn't a city school then. Well, we went to city school, yeah, but of course, we had to pay tuition. IA: Oh. So you must of had to go quite a ways to come in every day? MCQueen: Oh, yeah. Yeah, from Miller, do you know where Miller Road is? No, I don't. You know Jolly Road that you ••• Yes. IA: IS: IA: • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 4 IB: IA: McQueen: That's just south, •••••••• Miller is again, another mile south of that. Oh, my, okay. to school or got drive into school? Oh, so that was quite a commute then. You drove in Got a ride, you know, there was several of us and parents know, arrange to get us there and then part of the time, I worked for board and room to go to school, when I went to Eastern. quite a few of us did. Well, would, you IA: And you stayed downtown? McQueen: Urn, hum. IA: All by yourself? MCQueen: No, no, in a home ••• IA: In a family, with a family? McQueen: 'cause I did, you know, do, help take care of children Yeah, dishes or, you know, help with the housework. extra help, why they'd, a lot of times they'd take some of the students and come back Sunday night. in during the week and then we'd go home on Friday night The mother needed or wash IA: Hum, did you miss your parents when you did that? McQueen: Oh, sure, but, you know, it was a way to go to school. IA: IB: McQueen: To get a better education. And that's what everybody the ordinary. was doing, too, so it wasn't that out of Urn, hum, yes, everybody was a lot of 'em that couldn't pay that tuition that you had to pay and it was hard, you know, 'cause the farmers didn't make a lot of money. that could, you know and, of course, there But anyway, I made it. IA: Did you go, work at the Reo after high school or were there some other things that went on in between? McQueen: Oh, yeah, a lot of things went on in between. for a while and I didn't go to work for, to Reo until 1953. I work for the State IA: Okay. When you worked at the State, what did you do for the State? McQueen: Typing. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 5 IA: Typing, secretarial. Did you •••• MCQueen: Um, hum, clerical. IA: Did you learn typing and steno in school, in high school? MCQueen: In school, yeah, I took bookkeeping. IA: Bookkeeping? McQueen: Um, hum. IA: Did they have a pretty good course they offered in the Lansing schools for that? MCQueen: Um, hum. IA: Was it two years or four? McQueen: Well, it was three years in high school and one year in ••• IA: In business ••• MCQueen: No, junior high. No, did IA: Irihigh school. • McQueen: See, our, I went to Maple Grove through the eighth grade and then we had to go into town for the ninth and ••• IA: 10th through 12th, yeah, and you got all that training that you needed through there. you know, a lot of those kinds of courses••• Great, 'cause a lot of schools didn't have, McQueen: Oh, yeah, Eastern did. IA: So you worked for the State and then ••• MCQueen: Well, I worked at Motor Wheel for awhile during the War. I worked IA: IS: on inspection there. Okay, so that wasn't a clerical. Where those wheels for the Army trucks there, that you were inspecting or? McQueen: No, shells. IA: Oh, my. Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 6 IB: Shells, oh ••• McQueen: I worked on the shells. IB: Oh, they did the same as Oldsmobile did then, produce shells. Oh, I didn't know that. MCQueen: There for a short period. IA: Did you switch 'cause of the money or 'cause the War or ••• MCQueen: The War, well, of course, I had quit and got married and had a youngster and, you know, and then we moved to Florida. We were in Florida four years and then we came back to Michigan and I finally decided I wanted new furniture and new stuff so I thought, well, 'course Reo was hiring then and so I said, well, they'd had ads in for typists and all that and, of course, it'd been a few years since I done any of it. Anyway, I applied and I got in. IA: In '53? McQueen: Um, hum. IA: So when you started at Reo in '53, you just had the one child or ••• MCQueen: Um, hum. IA: He was already school age? MCQueen: Um, hum, well, he was, was he through school then? He must of been, no, he wasn't through school but, yeah, but he was ••• IA: School age, he was going to school then? McQueen: Oh, yeah. IA: And when you came back, did you buy a house in Lansing? McQueen: Um, hum. IA: And what neighborhood did you live in in Lansing? McQueen: At that time, we lived on the east side and then we moved over on the west side. IA: Did your husband work at Reo, too? MCQueen: No, he worked at Olds. IA: Oh, he was at Olds? • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 7 MCQueen: And then he was a contractor. IA: Oh, okay, then he went into business for himself. McQueen: After, after the War ••• IA: IS: John ••••••'s wife worked at Oldsmobile and he worked at Reo. •••••••• say it was a good thing because when Reo closed, at least there was still somebody who a job for a while till he could get his feet under him again. MCQueen: My father-in-law worked at Reo. IS: Oh, he did? MCQueen: Urn, hum. • IB: How long did he work there? MCQueen: Oh, gosh ••• IB: Long, long time? MCQueen: Yeah, he was there a long time. IA: He was one of the old timers? MCQueen: Urn, hum. IA: Did he work in the plant? MCQueen: Urn, hum. My son-in-law worked at Reo. He lives down the street there a little ways. that worked there. So we, I had a lot of people, I had a cousin In fact, I had two cousins that worked there. IA: Which department did you work in when you went in as a secretary? McQueen: IA: I wasn't a secretary then. was a typist. When I hired in, I hired in as a typist. I went in in the billing department. I A typist in the billing department. Okay. did the building department do? building department before. And what did that, what I don't think we've heard about the • MCQueen: It, oh ••• IA: IS: We really haven't, the building department. Billing. Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 8 IA: Oh, billing. McQueen: No, billing, billing. IA: Sorry. Billing department. I think we've heard of that. MCQueen: Yeah, that's what I thought, that's strange. IA: Okay, and so you were just a typist? McQueen: A typist, ah, huh. IA: Did they have like a pool, a typing pool? McQueen: No, huh, ah. IA: You were just one person with a ••• McQueen: Well, there were several of us in the department that did the typing, invoicing. IA: And did you have a woman supervisor over you? McQueen: I had a man. IA: IB: Oh, really? Do you remember who that was? McQueen: Ah, when I hired in it was Bill Luoma. IB: Bill? MCQueen: Luoma, L U 0 M A. IA: He was the supervisor of the billing department? MCQueen: Urn, hum. IA: And how long were you at Reo? From 1953 till like it closed? McQueen: Well, I retired in, February 28, 1975. IB: Just before the end, huh? McQueen: Urn, hum. IA: And where did you, you didn't, obviously didn't stay a typist in the billing department the whole time. • .,. • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 9 McQueen: No, no, no. bookkeeping and then I was transferred into export. I was a, let's see, I was a bookkeeper, went into IA: IS: Oh, we knew somebody there. Oh, yeah, was it Art Fromm, export? MCQueen: No, no. Art Fromm wasn't in export. IS: I'm trying to think who we interviewed that worked for export. MCQueen: Ah, Chuck Dunford? IA: IS: No. Go back a ways and maybe I can find it. MCQueen: Let me think. all gone now. and Marsh Mollet and he's gone. Chuck Dunford's the only one I think alive that worked in export when I came in. truck department and there was a parts, export parts, too. trying to think, Ed Rankin ••• See, the ones that I worked for in there are, they're Irene Larowe. She she's been gone quite a few years I worked in the I was IS: IA: IS: Oh, that's who it was. Ed Rankin, that's it. Ed Rankin, yeah, I was just getting back here. McQueen: Yeah, he was, yeah, he was in export parts. IA: IS: IA: MCQueen: That's right. Oh, yeah, here it is right here. We talked to him a few months ago. export. the bookkeeping in the department? I knew we talked to somebody in So you were in charge of keeping track of the billings and Yeah, the documents and all that type of thing. transferred, then I was transferred back to payables and that's where I worked when I, let's see, was I working in payables then? No, I was in receivables when I retired. They, you know, they'd get short of help when they'd, you know, lay somebody off and then they'd transferred you around or you could, you know, 'course, when the union came in, why, when a job came up, you could, but I was in, I was bookkeeper when, you know, at the end there, when the union came in, I still was bookkeeper. Then I • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 10 IA: When did the union come in, the UAW union, right? MCQueen: Yeah. I don't remember. IA: You don't remember? closer to when you first started in the '50s? Towards the end of when you were there or McQueen: Oh, no. It was closer to the end. IA: Towards the end, in the '60s sometime? McQueen: I can't remember when. Probably. '70s. mistake anyway, when they put the union in the office. they had it in the plant ••• I really don't know. I can't remember. Must of been late '60s, early It really was a Of course, IA: In the plant .•• MCQueen: Yeah, but in the office, why ••• IB: How did it change things? You say it was a mistake? MCQueen: IB: IA: MCQueen: Well, you know, it was, there was a lot of bickering I'm not gonna do that 'cause it's not my job ••••••••••••••• thing going. and, you know, this That's alright. If you want, we'll turn it off. No, but you know how it is, you know, I mean, and before, person got behind a little bit and needed some help, whoever little time, you would just automatically union came in, especially the newer employees, they didn't ••• help and then when the if one had a IA: They didn't have that same philosophy. McQueen: Huh, uh. just do nothin'. It's not my job. I'm not gonna do it. I'll sit here and IA: Do you think that most people wanted the union to be there? McQueen: I don't think so. Not the office. IA: Not within the office group, staff. had to ••• But it just was something that McQueen: Yeah, well, there was enough that wanted it so it carried. IA: Yeah, oh, there was a representation •••••••• • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 11 IB: Did you feel like you got more protection security, given the fact that I know Reo was kind of on shaky ground but do you think the Reo gave you a little more job security? for you job or your job McQueen: With the union in? IB: Um, hum. McQueen: I don't, not myself. to me, it didn't. I know there was some that it, it helped but IB: McQueen: That's usually the reason people want a union. They say it will ••. Well, see, you know, and like you say, like they say, they don't want to, you know, they want to do just what they're they don't want to do any more. gonna do and IB: So actually that would hinder production you could produce out of your departments. in a way, wouldn't it, what • MCQueen: IA: Just some of us, you know, that had been there several years and, I don't know, we all kind of worked together you know, if the workload something, it, you know. You do it. You didn't say, well, you're getting paid for that. got heavy or if somebody was off ill or in and helped and thought why you just pitched to help one another nothing of if, And you think the people who had this attitude description in? so I'm not gonna do it was more the young people coming of it's not my job McQueen: Um, hum. IA: They're the ones that seemed to ••• McQueen: Take advantage ••• IA: MCQueen: •••••••• feeling, I imagine. was mostly women. Women mostly 'cause the office staff Yeah, ah, huh. naturally Well, there was fellows, too. But, of course, there were more women working in the office. IA: And they just didn't have the same ••• MCQueen: Not the same feeling • IA: Feeling about the company. • Mab~l McQueen 6/16/92 Page 12 McQueen: No, we were all, you know, all friends and just, you know, just wanted to help one another. IS: IA: McQueen: Sure. You said that you hired in in '53 because you saw lots of ads 'cause the Reo wanted ••• Well, they were, the ad they had in for typists and I was kind of looking for work 'cause, you know, we'd just come home from Florida and trying to make, you know, get settled in again and so I, well, I'll go to work 'cause I wanted some new furniture gonna work for a year. and I was only IA: And you ended up working for 20. MCQueen: Twenty-two. IA: IS: Twenty-two. 'Course you liked where you were and ••• MCQueen: Pardon? IS: I say, you liked where you were and ••• MCQueen: Oh, yes. I, oh yes, I, oh, yeah. I loved my job. IS: And the money must of been satisfactory. McQueen: Yeah, it was, ah, huh. IA: Did you pick the Reo specifically if I could I'd like to work here •.• to work in? I mean, did you say, MCQueen: No, no. IA: You didn't? McQueen: No, just ••• IA: It just happened to be advertising you had a different think it was different, ended up at the Reo, at all and then let's say if you had hired on at Oldsmobile or some other company in town? so you went in there. 'cause you experience Do you McQueen: Well, of course, I don't know because I didn't work there ••• IA: You didn't work there. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 13 MCQueen: But ah, I was, I was happy at Reo. good supervisors. I was happy in my work. I had IB: MCQueen: Makes a lot of difference. atmosphere at Reo and obviously We hear so much about the family it was in the offices, too. Um, hum, oh yes, and, well, a lot of us are all just friends. mean, we meet once a month, you know, and have lunch and get together in between sometimes and ••• I IA: Did you and Marjorie Koehler work it out so that you'd live across the street from each other or was it just a coincidence? MCQueen: Well, she'd been out here different Well, she kind of, see, I had, I've been here 15 years, last week. ones of the girls, see there was quite a few that worked, the park •••••••• from Reo, even before I moved over here 'cause I, I when I sold the house, I lived on st. Joe in Gettysburg don't know if you're familiar. 15 years times, different lived in Estates. • • IB: Um, hum, I know where that is • MCQueen: And so anyway, I was, when I moved from the house, I had to do something. and I lived there until Of course, my husband passed away in '68 very suddenly '77. IA: So, right after you retired, you ••• McQueen: Well, it just was, you know, I had such a great big Well, shortly. lawn and a big home and it just, it was too much to keep up and everything all the benefits that lives over here, we were friends for many, many years and that's what got me over here. and at that time, why, 'course I wasn't old enough to get from taxes and all that and, anyway, this, the lady IA: Okay, and so some of the other ladies ••• MCQueen: 'cause you And then Marge, she, you know, she had her house and she'd there been wanting to get away from downtown know there's a lot of problems down there and gettin' worse, I guess, and so she'd been out here lookin' at different times and then one of my neighbors across the street, or lived across the street at that time, was over and we were talking, to the sale of one deposit, over here to buy and I was telling my neighbor one morning when she was over here for coffee and talking about it and she said, well, she said, they're gonna put theirs up for sale, too. She went home and she was telling her husband about Marge, you know, my friend and he says, well, why not a deposit but an agreement well, she'd made a that lives Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 14 didn't you tell her this was for sale 'cause they wanted to move to Florida and she says, well, she says, I told him I didn't think you wanted to go until, for a year yet and so he, anyway, he said, well, you tell her so if she's interested. I had, 'cause these friends, these people over here were friends of mine too and I didn't want to ••• Well, so I thought, well, gee, I don't know. IS: Kind of in the middle. McQueen: So anyway, I told her and so she said, oh, she says, I've Ah, huh. looked so much, she says, I'm satisfied. I don't know, we talked a little bit, not about the home or anything" and finally she says, well, maybe I'll come out and look at it. I said, well, it's up to you. in love with it. and tell these other people but they understood. Well, she went into it and she fell So anyway, she went down. I don't think I'll look. She hated to go down So IS: Oh, that was nice. MCQueen: IA: So anyway, those people just, you know, just out of the clear blue, sold theirs and they were nice neighbors, Marge and I have enjoyed one another. We go together all the time. I enjoyed them but too. in sort of your, you know, the family kind of thing that Yeah, it's nice to have somebody close by like that. interested we've talked about, the, I guess why you stayed when you were only intending what was good about the job and what you thought about the company in is if you participated and the other thing I'm really interested in the girl's club activities they did and um ••• to stay a year why you ended up staying 22 years. and, you know, what kind of things I guess I'm I mean, MCQueen: Well, had a lot of good things going. girl's club. Yeah, I belonged to the IA: Did that start right at the beginning? right from the start, when you first came in or ••• Did you participate in that MCQueen: Not when I first came in but shortly afterwards I joined. IA: Okay, it had been going on though? MCQueen: Oh, yes. IA: And it was mostly office workers? McQueen: Mostly, ah, huh. There were some from the factory. IS: Oh, were there really? • • • • Mabel MCQueen 6/16/92 Page 15 McQueen: Ah, huh. IS: IA: IS: Well, that's interesting to know. Yeah, we hadn't heard that. I hadn't heard that before. -McQueen: Yeah, there were some that belonged but it was mostly office. IA: And what kind of things did you all do when you met? McQueen: Talked and ate! IA: And ate, the same kind of things you still do over at the Golden Gate, right? MCQueen: Um, hum. IA: And just had a way to get together on a regular basis? • MCQueen: Um, hum, yeah, really that's what it was and sometimes they had Of course, they had mother and daughter banquets entertainment. and ••• IS: Oh, that's nice. MCQueen: You know, all the things that you do. IS: Is that where the Christmas baskets and things like that were assembled and did girl's club help with ••• MCQueen: Yes, ah, huh. IS: We talked with Hilda Smith and she was so proud of being able to put the Christmas baskets together. McQueen: She was the sweetest lady. IS: She is, isn't she? MCQueen: We always called her the sweetheart of Reo. IS: Is that, oh, really? The sweetheart of Reo, really? IA: • MCQueen: Um, hum. IA: You know, I've been noticing you have, you should see this, Shirley. Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 16 McQueen: Oh, that's what I got when I retired. IA: IS: IA: IS: The trucks ••• Oh, my goodness. and the cars and the ramp. Was that something or ••• that they made there and you were able to get 'em MCQueen: I don't know. had ••• They had, they had those plaques, they got, they IS: IA: IS: IA: IS: IA: McQueen: For the record we should say they're plaques of Reo trucks .•• There are three plaques of a Reo, Diamond Reo truck and a ..• And a 1904, maybe, oh, no, 1905 or 6 ••• Reo car and there's another 5peedwagon ••• And like a delivery truck, a 5peedwagon. Oh, those are wonderful. They really are very beautiful. I know, you know, they always gave you a gift when you retired, always gave you, and they always, they were giving these pen and pencil sets, you know, desk pen and pencil sets and, of course, man and he said, when I was gonna retire or knew the personnel something I said, I don't want one of them pen and pencil sets. I said, I want one of them, a set of those plaques and so nothing more was ever said and so when he ••• and I said, I don't know, something was said about it and they I IA: He probably thought, boy, we got a live one here. MCQueen: So when he came and brought my gift to me, 'course you know, we our picture, that, he brought it to me and he says, well, Mabel, said you didn't want one of them damn pen and pencil in fact, I got my pictures out there, I'll show you, and he says, you sets .•• IS: Well, this would mean more to you 'cause this represents exactly the things that ••• what, MCQueen: I know it, I, well, and it's, I don't know, a pen and pencil, would I put it. Of course, I didn't ••• where IA: In a drawer. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 17 MCQueen: Yeah. IB: And then the ink dries up over time. MCQueen: And unless you got a desk and everything, really ••• why, you know, you don't IB: You can't really display it. MCQueen: I've had more pen and pencils, did want those and at the time, we, I had a big rec room in our basement fireplace and I had an ideal spot to display anyway. and ••• I didn't need any more and I 'em there, too, over the IB: And this is a big chuck of your life. of your life where you worked. These represent a big chunk MCQueen: • IA: IB: Yeah, I've really enjoyed, unless you get over here, you don't see them. because, you come in 'cause it's a little, well, not really commercial ••• you know, it isn't something that hits you in the face when of course, But I like them I know different people, Oh, not at all. Oh, no, I don't think so. MCQueen: But anyway ••• IB: Are those made of metal? MCQueen: I don't know what, I think they are ••. IB: IA: IB: IA: McQueen: I've just never seen any like 'em. They are quite nice. old fashioned one. I particularly like the ane in the middle, the Yeah, it looks like a ••••••••••• looks like one ••••••••••• Beautiful. And then my little name plate in here, I retired, thing, I don't know if you can see it. here. is on a little Maybe, it's on this truck IB: Oh, I see it. It's just down below it. • MCQueen: Can you see it? IB: Yes, I can, just down below the Speedwagon. Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 18 IA: Oh, yeah. MCQueen: Yeah, I just love those. IB: They had a car ••• McQueen: Did I break it? IB: IA: IB: I don't think so. Nope, it's going ••• Oh, there you are. Oh, and there you are holding your truck and these are all, a lot of these gals are office gals that you worked with? McQueen: Ah, huh. IB: And who are these two gentlemen here? MCQueen: He was my supervisor. What the devil was his name? I forget and this was, he was personnel director, Let's see. Isn't that awful? Mike, hum ••• IB: He looks like he might have been some of the new men that came in. MCQueen: Yeah, he hadn't been there too ••• IB: They both look quite young. MCQueen: Yeah, this one was new. He worked, he was head of crafts. IA: This is a book they put together together? for you or did you put this MCQueen: IA: IB: Well, some of it they put together which was the, I got a picture of •••••••••••• got a lot of interesting ••• and some of it I did. to show you. Let's see, I've Oh, there's Reo's girl's club. Oh. McQueen: Did you ever see the ••••••• ? IB: No. McQueen: We just have to laugh at all that stuff. IB: Reo Girl's Present. Was this a little play or something they did? • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 19 MCQueen: This was one of our later••• IA: IB: IA: There's a Reo Girl's Club prayer that says, oh God, grant me live my days with kindly thoughts, words and deeds. May he help me meet my fellow men with patience and tolerance and to do unto them as I would have done unto me. to my club and agree to abide by the rules and regulations governing it. I promise to loyally and efficiently serve the club to the best of my ability and actively encourage others to maintain our purpose of friendship and service and this is from the Reo Girl's Club 1960 Handbook of Mabel McQueen and here"s all the different people in the club. Then the pledge says, I pledge allegiance And every member had a book? Everyone had your own book? MCQueen: Um, hum. IA: • IB: IA: IB: IA: Oh, look, here's your name printed on the cover. I had to learn that when I went into the 7th grade, the first day in 7th grade I had to learn that and I've always kind of made that my credo. And here they are. pictures. That's wonderful. It's just like a yearbook with all those This is terrific. We've never seen one of these. McQueen: Oh, really? IA: IB: No. No. I wonder if we see folks in here we've met? McQueen: Oh, I'm sure. IB: IA: IB: I bet there are. Not yet. Not yet but I bet there are. • McQueen: Oh, yeah, there's got to be somebody. IB: I see some have passed away. Oh, it's impossible to think about that happening, isn't it? Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 20 MCQueen: I know it. IS: Oh, there's Marge. MCQueen: Marge Koehler. Oh, yeah, there's several that you ••• IA: IS: Well, we've met Ardith Pappon. We have and we're hoping to get to speak with her. lady. She's a busy MCQueen: Oh, yes. IA: IS: IA: IS: IA: IS: IA: There's Mabel there. Oh, yes. Oh, I like your hairstyle. And these are kind of pictures ••••••••••••••• I remember those hairstyles. Candid shots, yes. •••••••••••• having fun and getting together • Oh, this is great. •••••• autographs. Oh, that is so nice • Did these come out every year? McQueen: Urn, hum. IA: These come out just about every year 'cause it says 1960. McQueen: Well, we didn't, we didn't have our pictures every ••• IA: Every year, I see, so this is a special version of it. Great. McQueen: The only thing I haven't got pictures of is the fire. IS: Oh, you know, I've got a chance to get some pictures of the fire. I've got to call that woman. McQueen: So you how Reo looked way back, these are all my retirement, some of them you might get a kick out of, crazy stuff. IA: Well, the firm didn't last much longer after you retired, did it, 1975? MCQueen: No, they, that's right. IS: I see you've clipped out some headlines and articles about the Reo. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 21 MCQueen: Um, hum. IB: Who are these gentlemen? MCQueen: Ah, that is Harry Elsenheimer. He's still alive and this is Enno Schraft. IB: Oh, okay, I've seen the name a lot. MCQueen: He's passed away. IB: He has? McQueen: Um, hum. another one Here I am with my little machine, one of 'em. There's IA: bookkeeping machines. McQueen: Yeah, I run those. IB: • IA: McQueen: Oh, you did? Now that's all on computer. Yeah, this is the old kind, way back. IB: Was it hard to learn to run? MCQueen: Well ••• IB: You didn't learn on ••• MCQueen: when I got this, this was simple. You know, I mean, everything was, you know, more modernized and that was, let's see, what did they call this one. Burroughs. I can't remember now. I •••••• 77, 78 both. This was the old 78, it was lB.: I've never seen a bookkeeping machine. McQueen: Haven't you? IB: No, and you probably didn't have those in the high school commercial classes so this is something you had to learn after you went to Reo. McQueen: Oh, that's one of my grandbabies. • IA: IB: Cute, that's a great poster. I like that. What a sweet baby. Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 22 McQueen: How come it got in here. IS: Aw, that's a good place for it. • McQueen: There's more of my, well, where is that picture that I really wanted to show you. IS: Is that a real fire truck? McQueen: I don't know what that, if that is or not or if that's, I can't read, I can't see to read it. IB: Let me see if I can. District, Diamond Reo. South Elgin and County Side Fire Protection MCQueen: Is it? IB: Here, it's our Diamond Reo truck. McQueen: Oh, yeah. I figured it probably had to be and this money was from a party that they had when they had the foreign dealers over for some, you know, like a convention deal and, dealer's thing and then a bunch of us were out one night and ••• • IB: Has pictures of the ••..••• McQueen: the guys, some of the guys signed, they had, like a Las Vegas night. IA: IS: Oh, I see. Oh, this says Seirut. MCQueen: Yeah, one of the fellows IB: IA: Must be that man was from Beirut and these are the Reo trucks. Did they have that upstairs in the clubhouse? McQueen: Um, hum. IA: Those kinds of receptions up in the clubhouse? McQueen: Um, hum, in the Steering Gear Room. IA: In the Steering Gear Room. McQueen: I can't figure out what I did with it. IS: We're still curious about where the big Steering Gear chandelier went when they tore the clubhouse down. • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 23 McQueen: I always wondered what become of the ball that was in the ballroom. IB: IA: IB: One of those that threw the lights all around? Oh, wow. I don't know. McQueen: I don't know what become of that either. Now, that's got to be here. I'm probably lookin' right over it. IA: IB: Well, I'm looking with you so••• We've been given the name of the clubhouse manager, maybe he knows. MCQueen: There it is, right there, is the one I was lookin' for ya. IA: Oh, it's an old postcard from 1906. MCQueen: • IA: IB: It was one that was sent to my folks. Well, we got home alright, sleepy and tired. Walter got a Oh, my. little lonesome Monday but now he is alright. care if this don't come, this something don't come. It says, he don't This looks like this might be Washington here 'cause that looks like••• IA: IB: IA: I've seen this picture. This is an old picture. And then the tracks must of gone back this way. Yeah. Who's this? MCQueen: Oh, that's a friend of mine. IA: IB: Oh, she looks real happy to be with you. Robert Block supervisor. MCQueen: Yeah, he was one of my supervisors. IB: And Myrna Austin. MCQueen: And she was a friend. Here, I'll let you go through if you want to look at it, see it from the beginning. She worked in my department. IA: Okay. thing that says, hello Reo Girls. I like that girl's club. That was wonderful. Here's another • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 24 McQueen: Yeah, we got one, every, once a year we had ••• IA: A little booklet? MCQueen: Ah, huh. IA: To announce the activities? McQueen: Yes and who was, you know, in charge and all that stuff. IA: IB: Oh, there's Doris's name. Oh, Doris Dow. She's an organized little lady, isn't she? MCQueen: Oh, yes, yes. She's ••• IB: She's nice. she seems to be very efficient now. I get the feeling that she was very efficient because MCQueen: Yeah, she does a lot for the union. IA: IB: Oh, here's the union ••• Oh, the local 6 •••• MCQueen: See, that's my retirement did. book for the things that we, that they IA: IB: IA: IB: Oh, I see. announced So the union also participated in your, well, they it in there, in the union newsletter~ Oh, this certifies Diamond Reo. the Mabel McQueen is a retired employee of Which mean you were entitled to whatever benefits went along with that through the union. This is where your union hall was, 1010 River Street. I don't think the building's that well. there anymore. I remember MCQueen: Isn't it? IB: IA: I'm not sure. a big printing There are some businesses firm and ••• down that way now. There's This is what the office looked like that you worked in? MCQueen: Urn, hum. IB: Oh, isn't that interesting? • • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 25 IA: IB: IA: IB: Yes, I'm very interested in this. The pant suits that were popular then. wear pants to work. Women started being able to That's nice. She looks like she's eating a chicken wing. MCQueen: Yeah, they had chicken. IB: IA: IB: Oh, I guess it. See, they had old, the different time because it was just starting with the electric. types of typewriters at the same Oh, gee, this really gives us a bird'seye view into the old offices. combined Were there several different in one big room? officers or were there several McQueen: It was a big room and ••• IB: IA: IB: MCQueen: It looked like it, though didn't it. With different sections ••• Different sections. Ah, huh. the beginning Later years, why they put, you know, dividers up but in there, it was all one, you know ••• IA: All the office workers in one big ••• McQueen: Um, hum, but you had your own department in certain sections. IA: And so how did you communicate offices around you, smaller ••• with the boss? Were they all in McQueen: No, they weren't, they weren't in offices at first. IA: Oh, okay. MCQueen: In later years, they divided them up and put 'em in their own IA: IB: Okay. But in the beginning, they were just all in this big room with you? MCQueen: Um, hum. Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 26 IS: I wonder if that got confusing with all the typewriters and the phones ringing and ••• MCQueen: Didn't seem to. IB: Didn't seem to. MCQueen: I guess we ••• IA: It was nice to be all together. MCQueen: grew up with it and ••• IB: That would be another thing that had the togetherness feel because you weren't shut away behind partitions. MCQueen: This is my son and daughter-in-law. IS: And did you say that he also worked at Reo? MCQueen: No, huh, uh. IB: Oh, it was your son-in-law, perhaps. MCQueen: My son-in-law, urn,hum. IB: He must of worked there close to the very end, then. McQueen: Yeah, he did but he had, I think 25 years in. IB: Oh, he did? Twenty-five years in. What did he do there, do you recall? Was he down on the, in the shop? McQueen: He was in the plant. IA: Who took all these pictures for you? McQueen: Oho, different ones that •••• IA: And the camera was just sort of around and people snapped? MCQueen: Urn, hum. party down at the Cozy •••••••••••••• Some were in the office and some were, see, they had my IA: IB: IA: Now, these are the more formal things. And here's the curtains that we saw in the ••• Yeah. • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 27 MCQueen: Yeah, these were the pictures that, see, this is, this was, this was my office back here. pictures 'cause we had a big window here and then the drapes and it was kind of a open deal. pictures. not. Irene Boynton, I don't know if you've talked to her or There's my machine but they took most of the So that's usually where they took the IB: No. That's a new name to me. McQueen: She was not here so, she's in a different area. IB: Where were your offices in relationship to the shop? Were you along Washington or ••• MCQueen: Well, you know, the main building on Washington, right next to the clubhouse ••• IB: Next to the clubhouse ••• McQueen: Well, I was in that building, that main building, the original. IB: IA: I see, okay • This is a much older picture. MCQueen: Urn, hum. IA: IB: IA: You can just tell from the outfits. Oh, I like that. What's this a picture of here? McQueen: Well, let's see, that was the ••• IA: This looks like it's from the '50s. McQueen: Must be when she retired 'cause I, I took her job when she••• IA: And who is she? McQueen: Frances Salas. She's gone now, too. IA: IB: Frances Salas. That's not Hilda, is it? McQueen: No, that's Myrna Austin. • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 28 IB: Oh, okay, I was just going by the shape of the face and the eyebrows. McQueen: This is Bea Wecker. She goes to the, that annual dinner. IB: Does she? MCQueen: Uh, huh, and this is Norma Jean Moray and this girl is Arlene can't remember There's me back in there. her last name. and I IB: Oh, just peeking through. McQueen: IA: IB: IA: And Grace Bilby, it's Elsenheimer have you been to the dinner that we have out at Coral Gables? You probably met her at, now. We will be. No, we're going, we're going there in August. We'll be there in August. MCQueen: Usually, she's ••• IA: She's a pretty lady. MCQueen: Ah, huh, and this lady Kathleen DeWitt. IA: So you have this in here because you took her job? McQueen: Um, hum. IA: She was the, and was this when you went into the bookkeeping? McQueen: Bookkeeping, ah, huh. IB: She must of started at quite a ••• McQueen: Yeah, she was right out of high school, she started there. IA: IB: IA: IB: In the '20s probably. Yeah, I was just thinking. And these are all just clippings from the end of the Reo. Diamond Reo, quiet giant. MCQueen: I got that ••• IB: Eaton tried, couldn't turn Reo around. Oh, now when did ••• • • • • Mabel MCQueen 6/16/92 Page 29 McQueen: He was a vice president. 18: Was he? McQueen: Um, hum. IB: IA: He was the vice president. He looks so young. MCQueen: Yeah, he was young. ••••••••••••••••••••••••••• IA: IB: IA: IB: No, we haven't heard from him. No, I haven't either. there. Okay. Boy, you've got a lot of history of Reo in 1 I'd love to Xerox some of those newspaper clippings. Would that be possible, Mrs. McQueen? • McQueen: Oh, sure, if you'd like to. IB: I'd love some, just, we would just keep the Xeroxs in the records at the Museum •. I'm sure we don't have anything like that. MCQueen: I wish I had more room to put more •••••••• IA: IB: Sesquicentennial. Sesquicentennial. Ex-owner of Reo and u.S. settle feud. Fred O'Brien, Charles Rei •••••• Somebody said that he's in a rest home now? Oh, here's MCQueen: Yeah, he's at 18: That's what I just heard. announce an out of court settlement with a former owner of Diamond Reo Trucks. ••••••• news conference Wednesday to MCQueen: So you see why I ••••••• Reo? IA: Oh,yeah. It looks like you all had a nice group together. • MCQueen: When I retired, they did, they used to always say that they was gonna have my retirement party at the Civic Center. was big enough. This was to settle the pension fund. 18: No place else • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 30 IA: IB: IA: IB: IA: Oh, it ••••• about the ••••••• Yeah, former owner of the Diamond Reo Trucks and the u.s. government feud out of court opening the door after 10 have settled a pension years for former Diamond Reo employees to settle their claims. Oh, my. And it goes on about Mr. Cappart. Those are some wonderful ••• So you got out right before the, all the problems very lucky. started. You were MCQueen: Yeah, I am. IA: 'Cause a lot of people we've talked to have been very, you know, were very disturbed went on at the end. going to be happening? and upset, you know, by all the finagling Did you, did you think something like that was that McQueen: Well, it didn't look good. IA: From what you could see? McQueen: Um, hum. IA: Yeah, and you were always involved with the money so ••• McQueen: And I was eligible points, so. for retirement so, you know, with my age and my IB: Oh, they built up a point system? MCQueen: Urn, hum. 18: How was that arrived at? McQueen: Well, your age plus your years of service. IB: IA: Oh, I see. So seniority and age. MCQueen: Um, hum. You had to have so many points to retire which I had. IA: MCQueen: Was that the company's plan or did the union devise that? I think that was a company,' I think we had that right from the very • start. • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 31 IA: IB: I see, okay. So you were able to retire and get your benefits? McQueen: Um, hum. IB: Before all the problems started. McQueen: For a while •..••..•••.......... IA: Oh, and so then, then they became diminished when the company went under. MCQueen: Um, hum. IB: Oh, that's right, that's right. McQueen: Yeah, 'cause when I retired, see, I had, my insurance was paid, life insurance and medical, Blue Cross and then, you know, our pension, of course you got, you know, and then we got that extra little deal that you get. I can't remember what they called it now • IB: Profit sharing? MCQueen: Something, no, it wasn't profit sharing. I don't remember now. can't remember. I IB: Like a cost of living, maybe? MCQueen: No. IB: But some other little fund. MCQueen: It was a, well, then when you were a certain age then that quit and Social Security t00k on or something. I can't remember what. IB: Something that took you through that gap of time. McQueen: But see, when they folded, then I lost all my ••• IB: You lost your insurance, your medical insurance and you lost your retirement benefits. MCQueen: Life insurance. IB: Life insurance • McQueen: So now all I get is just a straight pension and Blue Cross takes, oh, just about all that. • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 32 18: That's what we've heard from other folks that what they get from what's left of their pension just about covers their insurance. MCQueen: Yeah, that insurance is terrible. 18: IA: Oh, it's terrible. Yeah, I hear that from my parents# too. McQueen: Sometimes I wonder do I need all that and yet you ••• 18: And yet you don't dare be without it. last turbulent another ownership. years when Reo was going from one ownership to How was that for you girls in the office? So you were there during the MCQueen: Well, it was hard 'cause you never knew from one month to the next if you were, if you had a job. IA: Oh, 'cause you were concerned that you might ••• MCQueen: else bought, like when White Motors bought If somebody it, you know, you didn't know if they were gonna bring all their own people or if, you know, what would happen or if they'd move everything know, their ••• to, you 18: Chicago or some place. So you went through several changes. McQueen: Oh, yeah. 18: Diamond Reo, White first, I guess. order. I get confused about which McQueen: I can't really, I can't either. 18: At any rate, two or three different time. changes within a short period of MCQueen: Yeah, I worked, yeah, I worked ••• 18: What did you think of Mr. Cappart when he came and took over. MCQueen: I didn't think too much of him, and Mildred mean, they come in there and started cracking the old whip and letting this one go and that one go and firing for no reason at all. either, you know, I 'em right and left 18: Just to cut the payroll, do you think? MCQueen: That and break the union. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 33 IA: IS: Oh. Oh, they wanted to break the union? McQueen: In fact, they said that. IS: IA: MCQueen: Oh, they did? The union that you were in or the one in the plant? Well, the plant. they came in or not. happens to you up here! I can't, I can't remember if we had our union when I can't remember what year we, something IS: I know, forgetting things ••• McQueen: If you've been talking to any of the rest of the people ••• IS: It's getting terrible. memory but I can't find it. I bought a book on how to improve your McQueen: Well, that helped a lot • IS: So you see how bad things are. MCQueen: Yeah, I know it. I just, it's terrible. IA: Sut they were hostile to unions regardless office or in the shop? of whether it was in the MCQueen: Yeah, I think that they just, you know, I don't know. don't know what they ••• I really IS: McQueen: Well, they probably they wanted over things if the union also had control to abide by what the union said was gonna happen. were successful in breaking the union? Maybe they were. couldn't of had as much as, as much control as and they had I wonder if they I don't know. our last contract everybody ••• I always wondered, you know, when they had a, when came up, I probably shouldn't say this in front of IS: Do you want this off? McQueen: Yeah, let's shut that off. IS: You were talking about the military contracts • McQueen: Yeah, when they, when we got the military carried us through and so they did ••• contracts, of course, that • • Mabel MCQueen 6/16/92 Page 34 IA: When did the military contracts start to come back after World War II. I mean, obviously, there was a lot••• McQueen: I can't tell ya. I can't ••• IA: IB: IA: You don't know. Probably Korea. from the beginning when you started in '53? McQueen: No, no. IA: Okay. McQueen: Not then. IA: But some time after. McQueen: After, ah, huh. IA: See, 'cause see, Korea was '50. MCQueen: Was it? IB: IA: '50, through till '52. Yeah, and she started '53. McQueen: I don't recall of it anyway. Of course, I ••• IB: 'Course the military would keep a contract, they would want to keep ••• MCQueen: Yeah, they had to keep some, yeah. IB: Had to keep building their supply of trucks. MCQueen: And Reo did get a lot of their contracts so, you know, that was basically, I think, what kept Reo ••• IA: Going. McQueen: on top, ah, huh. IB: And finally,when those ran out, that really helped to signal the end, too, didn't it. Money wasn't coming in. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 35 IA: Did you have, did you deal a lot with the military, the payment to the military and the things in your dealing with bookkeeping and billing and export? McQueen: Well, to a certain extent. IA: So you knew some of the materials you were working with were connected to the military production. It was all included in the ••• MCQueen: Yeah, because see, I did the statements that went out to the different dealers and, you know ••• IA: And they were allover the world. military installations? They were allover and also McQueen: Um, hum. IA: So that wasn't done in a separate place? regular billing for the company that did that. It was all part of the • McQueen: McQueen: IA: Well, each department had their own, you know, they had their military section• Section. Oh, I see, that's how they did it. Each section ••• But see, I run the statements that went out for the ••• IA: The billing? McQueen: 'Cause I got all the invoices in. IA: I see and so some of them would go to military installations and would get trucks or other types of material and some of it would go to private dealers or other people who needed parts, you know, private citizens. MCQueen: Yeah, there was parts and trucks. IA: Right, so it was both that you dealt with. MCQueen: Domestic parts and foreign parts and foreign trucks. IA: Now, we've heard a lot about the different countries and I can't remember who it was. Maybe it was 'Ed Rankin, he said he went to Iran or Iraq or some place ••• IB: • IA: Iran, I think it was and got sick and had to come back. Somebody went to Pakistan. You know, they were all over the place, tracking down these trucks and what they needed and ••• Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 36 IB: McQueen: IB: Being in the position you were in there, you really sawall of the business that Reo had, I mean, that Reo was doing. in the know on what was going on. people. Probably a lot more than a lot of You were really uh, huh. Seeing the bills come in and the statements go out. heard a secretary knows more about a business than the boss does. I've often IA: There's no question about it. MCQueen: Well, that's true. IA: There's no question about it. McQueen: You know, because, in fact, they run the place practically. IA: IB: Absolutely. I can see where a ••• McQueen: But it was an interesting job. I really enjoyed my work. IA: It didn't get boring to do it? McQueen: It kind a got hectic at times but ••. IA: But it wasn't, it didn't become routine, though. did ••• Some times it McQueen: You mean boring? IA: Well, just like doing the same thing, you know, over and over and over again. MCQueen: No, not to me it wasn't. It was, of course, there were separate accounts, you know, like you had to keep all,the trucks separate and the parts and the miscellaneous, you know, all the other stuff that's involved. IA: IB: IA: The person that we talked to last week was one of the industrial engineers who was involved with the ••• Oh, Mr. Chamberlain? Mr. Chamberlain, I don't know if, you may not have known him. was involved in the time and motion studies, the work studies. He MCQueen: What was his first name? • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 37 IA: Calvin. MCQueen: Oh, yeah, Cal. IA: Did they do any, did he and his department, Right. were involved and more efficient. office workers or was it just in the plant? you know, they in making the work go faster and better and smoother Did they do any of that kind of study for the McQueen: I don't know. I don't know. I don't really know. IB: IA: Nobody ever came ••• So they didn't do anything like that with you? MCQueen: Not that I know of. If they did it, it was, .you know ••• IA: other people. IB: • IA: IB: IA: IB: IA: It'd be a little difficult, wouldn't it, to be a time study on ••• It's been done though • Has it really? Yeah, and it's being done a lot more now with word processors ••• Oh, I was, well, of course, yeah. Okay. But I was just curious since you worked all the way up to '75 and there was already electric, typewriters there were some more electric and fancy ••• McQueen: And IBM came in ••• IA: machines. MCQueen: while I was there. IB: IA: Did it? Right, that's right. Did they have, oh, what are they called? McQueen: Keypunch? IA: Keypunch. Did they have that too? • MCQueen: Yeah. IA: But you didn't work on those? Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 38 McQueen: No, no. IA: IB: IA: IB: IA: IB: But those keypunch minute, per hour. operators, they had to do a certain amount per Yes, so many cards per hour. Is keypunch anything like comptometer? Comptometer machine. is an old business machine, accounting, bookkeeping Okay, forerunner of keypunch cards? Yeah, oh, it's from the 1920's, comptometer operators are •••••••• 'Cause I know even through the '30s and '40s, I would hear people going to comptometer In fact, I think there used to be a school in the Michigan Arcade upstairs. school. IA: Yeah, that's an old fashioned machine. McQueen: Yeah, that was something efficiently. too. I never learned to run, not IA: IB: IA: IB: IA: McQueen: But the things you worked on were already much more advanced comptometers you know, old fashioned than anyway so, 'cause those were like, just, calculators, types of calculator machine. Oh, were they? They weren't any kind of a keypunch card? No. Okay. I've always been curious about that. No, but I was wondering technology they did any of that kind of efficiency started to come in already by the '60s, I was curious if since it did get more, you know, the work in the office at all. Not that I know of. billing, you know, by typewriter. First we had just a plain old ••• See, when I first started there, we did the IA: Right, you stuck it in the machine ••• MCQueen: Yeah, and, manual. that was something. IA: It sure is. Well, then we got electric typewriters and boy, McQueen: Yeah, you just touched the thing and you ••••••••••• IB: Very, very light touch. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 39 MCQueen: But used to, your fingers would get, I remember when I first went to work, my fingers would get so sore on the ends from typing on the manual and, you know, you put out a lot of ••• IA: It's a lot of energy, that's right. MCQueen: when you, and my wrists would get so sore. And especially course, once you get into it, why then they get tough and then after that, then we got billing machines which was, you know, much easier, too, you know, everything. 'cause it did all the adding and everything Of on IB: Oh, they do? McQueen:Ah, huh, and then when I went into, well, it was in receivables at that time, when I went on to the bookkeeping old, let's see, I can't remember that I started on which had a big long carriage were 18 registers interesting. and I had a machine if it was a '77 or '78 Burroughs and I think there and, of course, you had ••••••••••••• That was IB: You had to line 'em up or something? McQueen: Well, you could set it up and it automatically keys, it would go to the register go in that. then it broke down in the different that it was charged to. there'd be two or three different to like miscellaneous See, it did the billing or whatever. categories, like punch in certain and print the amount that should and did, for the statements and different accounts Certain parts would be, you know, maybe accounts that it would be charged IB: Did those machines ever screw up, put the wrong ••• McQueen: Well, not unless you did it. IB: McQueen: IA: I was just wondering again it's human error. 'cause you know, computers, of course, there Oh, the machine would sometimes Maybe it wouldn't to call a repairman as the operator ••• break down or act up, you know. stay where it was suppose to and then you'd have but ordinarily, they worked pretty good as long that I used to work when I was a teller Those are like the machines in a bank, are the same things, you put the bank book, remember people used to walk around with their bank books, that kept track of what their savings account had and you put it in and it would go, shhh, shhhh, shhh and enter all the different interest and everything date on it. and make a total at the bottom So it was the same ••• things and the and put the • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 40 MCQueen: Yeah, it would balance, you'd have to balance across and you'd have to balance down. IA: Right, down, that's right. McQueen: And that was interesting, problem was transpositions. you know. sometimes you'd, my biggest IA: And what's that? MCQueen: Transposition something. of figures, like instead of 449, I'd put 494 or IB: Oh, okay. Transcribing, you might make a mistake. McQueen: That was one of my ••• IB: One of the things that you had to watch out for. McQueen: I just did it, you know, I still do it. divisible by 9, I think it was. But usually it was IA: The totals? MCQueen: Ah, huh. IA: So you could check that. McQueen: I mean, that was one of the first things you checked, because that was my, my think I'd guess you'd call it today. or I did IA: And how would you find out if you made a mistake? customer and say, •••• comeback Would the McQueen: No, no. IB: It just wouldn't balance. MCQueen: Your sheet wouldn't balance. IA: IB: IA: Wouldn't balance, okay. The down totals wouldn't match the totals across and then you knew you had a problem. And then when did the next, sort of generation after that Burroughs machine? of technology come in MCQueen: After the Burroughs? Well, that's when I worked on that last ••• • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 41 IA: Oh, that big machine, the big billing machine. McQuaen: Sensimatic. IA: Sensimatic. That was more like a computer really. McQueen: IA: IS: Right. it was a lot simpler. very hard to, just did it. Well, I guess, I don't really understand the comput~rs but It was easier, you know, I mean, it wasn't You just punched it in? When you went from one machine to a newer machine, in and train you on the new machine, made the machine? someone from the company that did someone come MCQueen: Um, hum, •••••••••••••••••••••• IS: Did Reo ever send you to take any courses, any kind of office courses to help you on your job? McQueen: Huh, ah • IS: IA: IS: 'Cause we've talked to a few that have been sent out for specific ••• Yeah, mostly supervisory people. Um, hum, but I didn't know where they also might send some of the secretarial pool to learn new procedures or ••• MCQueen: I don't know about the secretaries didn't. but as far as I know, they IS: Well, I guess I meant ••• MCQueen: IS: IA: I suppose with the comp operators them, they might of sent them, I don't know. job training. or, you know, back when they had All mine wason the On the job. Sometimes that's the best way. So you didn't really have to deal with kind of public, receptionist or phones or any of that kind of stuff? in your job, MCQueen: No, I had my own phone but not to the outside. IA: Did you ever think that there was any ways you could, you know, move up to management outside of clerical? types of positions MCQueen: I had no desire, really. • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 42 IA: You didn't want to? McQueen: No, I was contented where I was. I started ••• Of course, I'd moved up from where IA: Right, from a typist ••• MCQueen: right up to top bookkeeper. IA: IB: Yeah, right, and that was, that was, that was a pretty high level office job within the group there. you must of been pretty good with figures though I'm thinking because you h.ad highschool into being able to do this high level bookkeeping, must of not only got good instruction been pretty good with numbers and liked to do that sort of thing. and to go from that I'm thinking you in high school but you must of bookkeeping courses McQueen: Yeah, I liked it. IB: You must of been, probably got good grades in that in high school. MCQueen: Urn, hum, yeah, I had, that was my, you know ••• IA: IB: IA: McQueen: That was what you liked to do. 'Cause most people now have to go, say, to get an associate or something ••• degree Yeah, my mother had to go to business in business college. college. She took bookkeeping Well, of course, you know, if I'd a done that, getting load, I mean ••• into Reo early, I mean, I kind of graduated 'course, you know, by with the work IA: Right, you learned it as it changed itself. McQueen: I learned from, from doing. IA: That's right. MCQueen: Where if I'd a went right into bookkeeping, would have had to have some training, you know. why then I probably IA: Right from the start, yeah. McQueen: But I had the basics of bookkeeping from school. IA: So you had the foundation to learn the other stuff. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 43 McQueen: 'Cause I took all the courses of typing and bookkeeping that. and all IB: This big room that you mentioned, departments what you did maybe ••• in, would personnel that had all the different be maybe at one end of the room and • McQueen: No, personnel was over on Baker street. IB: Oh, it was in a separate building. McQueen: Um, hum. 18: I just wondered that main building. if they had everything clerical all in, all along in McQueen: let's see, there was receivables see, on the side I was on in this building, Well, mostly and (end building, side 1) ••••••••• then, of course, down, I worked on second floor and then on first floor, they had purchasing. They were kind of, you know, everybody was in one big room but still we were divided into our ••• and payables this main IB: Into departments. Were there two floors to that building or three? MCQueen: Three floors. 18: Three floors. What was up on third? More offices? MCQueen: Ah, huh, ••••••••• up there, military was up there for a while. IB: Oh, I see. MCQueen: And I think Marge worked up on third floor. IA: We'll have to ask her. McQueen: Yeah, I'm sure she worked up on the third. export parts was up there. I know military and IA: Did you go, besides for the girl's club meetings you go over to the clubhouse very much, the Reo Clubhouse? there a lot of activities going on there? and activities, Was did McQueen: The charity ball. • IA: MCQueen: The charity ball • You head about that? Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 44 IA: IB: No. No. McQueen: Oh, haven't you really? IB: Tell us about the charity ball. MCQueen: Oh, that was the highlight of the year. IB: Oh, it was? McQueen: Ah, huh. IB: What time, was it held always, say at Christmas time or something? McQueen: Ah, huh, ah, huh, before Christmas. IB: Before Christmas. Was that a fancy dress formal ball? McQueen: If you wanted, ah, huh. Usually everybody, you know ••• IA: Was everybody invited, the whole plant or .•• MCQueen: Ah, huh. IA: Really? And they sold tickets for charity? McQueen: Ah, huh. IA: Where did the charities go to, do you know? Just to ••• MCQueen: Well, like the Christmas baskets and ••• IA: IB: MCQueen: IA: IB: Oh, I see, the things the company did. So it was in house kind of things? Urn, hum, yeah, and the families, you know, that worked there that bad, you know, tough times or illness or, it all went for, for our own people. To help, I see. There again, it's the family thing and the family helps the members. McQueen: Oh, that charity ball was, you know, it was with big ballroom dancing and ••• IA: And had a band? • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 4S McQueen: Ah, huh. Yes. They always had prizes. IA: How many people would go, hundreds? McQueen: Oh, gosh, that place would be packed. IA: IB: IA: Packed. Really? Yeah, I'm surprised we haven't heard about that. MCQueen: I am, too, 'cause that was the big thing. to the charity ball. Everybody looked forward IA: Ah, huh. there? Do you know how long it had been going on when you got Was it something new or had been going on a long time. McQueen: I can't remember. I think it had ••• • IA: IB: IA: Had been going on for a while. Oh, we'll have to ask when we're talking to folks that have been there since the '30s or the '40s. Did you go to the picnics 'cause I know they used to have company picnics, too? McQueen: I can't remember if I ever went to any picnics or not. IA: IB: Okay. But you're saying the charity ball people from all over the plant and the offices •••• McQueen: Oh, yeah, everybody. IB: Get a big representation across ••• McQueen: Yeah, the place was always full. IB: My mother worked there, too, but I never heard her mention the charity ball. She worked out in the plant but ••• McQueen: It was one of those bring your own-booze or whatever you wanted you wanted to drink. They had big, you know, tables set up for people to sit at • IB: Did they have food, too? • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 46 McQueen: I think just what you took for your, you know ••• IB: Oh, you kind of brought your own snacks and ••• McQueen: Um, hum, I think that's the way we did it but I know you brought whatever you, you know, wanted to drink and I think they had the mix there, you know, so they made a little profit on mix and they may of had, you know, like chips and stuff like that. IB: But it wasn't a dinner dance? MCQueen: No, huh, ah. IB: Buffet kind of thing at the end of the evening or, okay, well, of course, that would of cut down on what the ••• McQueen: It was strictly, be. well, you know how the red stocking dance used to IB: I remember the red stocking dance but I don't know •.• MCQueen: It was just about the same. IB: Same kind of thing. McQueen: Not quite as formal lot of us did. IA: Got all dressed up. McQueen: In long dresses. IB: Did you? but if you wanted to go formal, but, you know, a McQueen: In fact, I've got, I think I've got the last dress, last Oh, yes. formal that I wore. I don't know why I keep it. IB: Well, sentimental reasons. MCQueen: It's, well, it's a nice dress. IA: That's a good reason to keep it. You never know. MCQueen: I probably do with it otherwise. couldn't even get into it anymore but anyway, what do you IB: You keep 'em in the closet and once in a while you· look at it. .' • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 47 MCQueen: Yeah, yeah, remember, deal, you know. go •. yeah. Yeah, it was a, it was a big family You invited your family. I know my kids used to IA: Oh, you mentioned a son. You had other children besides your son? MCQueen: I have two step-daughters. IA: Oh, and two step-daughters. Okay. MCQueen: Yeah, their kids used to go and they just loved it. girls and she wasn't old enough to go, you know, when they closed down and she was so mad 'cause she never got to go. One of the IA: IB: She didn't get a chance. 'Cause that was quite a place, the civic center of its day sort of. MCQueen: And that was a shame that they let that place go down. of been kept for historical ••• That should IB: I agree with you. transportation grounds of the Reo. As the Museum tried to get museum. That would be the perfect place for the R.E. Olds What better place than right there, on the a matter of fact, the people that started that building. , MCQueen: Did they? IB: and they'd have to bring it up accessible up road it, which, of course, have cost that much. Urn, hum, and the city owned it and they just kept throwing blocks and finally they said that, then if the people wanted they'd have to do all this remodeling to code for handicap but that wouldn't some ramps and that kind of thing the main floor but they just kept throwing, They just kept throwing up road blocks and want them to have it. finally it got to be so expensive by the time they added this and this and this that the people just, you know, they said, well, we We're just a group just haven't got that kind of money, you know. of individuals and we're trying to start a museum to honor Lansing built transportation. is understandable It would just have required 'cause they would have only used it was as if they didn't MCQueen: I know, it's a dirty shame ••• 18: It is a shame. McQueen: that that wasn't ••• IB: We talked to someone along the road, it's not someone we've interviewed yet but it's ••• • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 48 IA: IB: IA: IB: Oh, the man who has all the memorabilia? Well, no, what I was thinking of is somebody who said that, maybe it was the ••••••••••• that the day that the, the last day, the final day when the place closed down that they hadn't known it was gonna close, they knew it was gonna come sometime but they didn't know when and she went to work, in front of the building and the doors were padlocked worked, obviously, and she thought, well, they'll open tomorrow nonplussed back the next day and then she didn't know it till she read it in the paper. where you and she was really so she went I don't remember who it was either but I do remember the story. I don't remember the office, the people that owned it or sent down any kind of a directive either but they hadn't, obviously or a bulletin or anything. hadn't come to MCQueen: Yeah, I remember that that they, you know, they didn't know ••• IA: 'Cause you were still in touch with all your friends, probably, many of them working there. you were still MCQueen: Yeah, they padlocked it. IB: Without ever sending a-letter or coming around and saying, your last day Friday's McQueen: Oh, yeah. ~I • • IB: MCQueen: IA: Isn't that strange. were running it at th to us the other day t at he just cried. difficulty last, doesn't it? with it. ust kind of indicates the kind of people that Mr. Bowles, I think said A lot of people really had Yeah, I know, I know my supervisor, when they let him go, he just, of course, you know, they let some other ones go and then when Bob come out and he walked by my desk and he said, -bye Mabel and I knew then, you know, I mean, I just, I just almost cried myself used to say when we, you know, well, Mabel, he says, they just, can hang on just a few more years, he says, we'll have it made, he says. We'll get our pensions downhill. and then it happened to him and he just went Well, that's what took him, I think. 'cause he He didn't have a lot to live for. supervisors such a difficult that point. or in, you know, management time to try to find something So many of the men who were positions were in their 50s, new, you know, at • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 49 McQueen: IA: IB: Well, my son-in-law, I know. job and he was in his '40s then. time. just, he just retired from there in February. when he, he had a hard time finding a Yeah, he was out of work a long Well, finally he got in at Lansing Drop Forge. In fact, he Most drop forges haven't been doing too well either. Oh, dear. It used to be, several years ago when all the drop forges were going and the Atlas, you could hear those big hammers going and it was just part of your life to hear those going all night long and during the day you didn't hear them as much, of course, but ••• MCQueen: With all the other noise. IB: • MCQueen: IB: at night, you could always hear 'em, especially 'cause you had your windows mentioned there, to get photographs of the fire. photographs We have an opportunity, the fire. open. on summer nights It was just part of Lansing. I hope it's ~till You of a, a private citizen who took Oh, do you? book, to complete it. Well, I'd like to have one, you know, to put in my She doesn't, to let me take 'em. and I've been stalling, she moved from one place to another and things were packed Well, I'll have to get in touch with her and see if she's still willing find the negatives because away, you know, how it is when you move and she just didn't know where they were. she knew but when she went through they weren't there but she"s got photographs call her and see and if I'm successful then we'll have to have negatives I'm successful, hoping she'd find the negatives I'll see that you get one. in getting the photographs made and prints from that and if so I think I'd better she couldn't She thought and MCQueen: I'd pay for one ·of 'em. IB: Oh, well, a print wouldn't cost that much. McQueen: Well, I know, but you have to do very many, I mean, if you do bring one, I'd like to have one for my book. IB: Well, I'll trade a photograph of your Reo and newspaper articles. for you for the chance to Xerox some MCQueen: Oh, okay. Okay. IB: That would be really wonderful archives. for the Museum to have those in their • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 50 IA: 18: IA: 18: IA: 18: IA: 18: IA: 'cause it's hard to find, you know, the only other way to find Yeah, them is to flip through day after day 'cause the Lansing Journal's It's hard to find them ••••••••••••••••••••• not indexed or anything so you can't just look 'em up. state Oh, really, I've never tried to, in fact, I've wondered everything down at the state Journal? on microfiche what, is It is but there's no index. Oh, my goodness. You just go through date by date? I mean, this one day it was closed but if you want to find out about Cappart in an event like the fire, obviously date but the Reo, you know, its changes Yeah and if you're interested you look at that particular and its demise was a long term process. obviously coming in and this one coming in, you really have to almost look at years worth to get all the information somebody's already done so that's very good. that's indexed in any really good way is the New York Times which would probably have a little bit about it when the Reo closed maybe or something state Journal would have, obviously. already cut 'em out, makes it, have your work, you know, The only, the only newspaper have all the specifics from the Journal but it wouldn't that the Lansing so but if I would think they would have been, you know, on the stock Exchange or something so there'd be some notation ••• Right, yeah, there would be some indication ••• They wouldn't in the last few years. have been very high on the Exchange I wouldn't think Since I'm a historian, in, you know, particularly have very indepth information That's really very helpful to have that. No, and it might be, you know, the article might be this big, you know, and it wouldn't but still, so this is great. have a couple more questions. interested worked at the same place for a long time, 22 years, what you~ feelings are about how things changed over time because really all historians time. So just, you know, how your feelings about, you know, working at the Reo was like when you started in 1953 till when you ended in '75, what you think the biggest differences the working conditions people, you know, anything that you think is important changed. or the company itself and the philosophy in is how things changed over I'm very like you who were in, you know, in are interested with people to about what I just that's or McQueen: I don't know. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 51 IA: Most people don't think in those terms but that's the only way historians think. McQueen: I mean, it, it just was so gradual it seemed like and, of course, the position I was in, it was just a ••• in IA: The technology is changing. MCQueen: Ah, huh. IA: You mentioned the atmosphere? the young people coming in. Did that change a lot of MCQueen: I think so, you know, their attitudes were different. IA: and that was through the '60s, you think that that started Different a lot or was it happening the whole time? MCQueen: No, just in later years. IA:• IA: MCQueen: The later years, yeah. government contracts, other people have mentioned, action hirings the affirmative because changed of the things • Well, yeah. That the kinds of people that were hired maybe weren't quality or weren't necessarily much. ••••••••• company, as high didn't care as McQueen: Didn't care, you know, they were there to get their ••• IA: Paycheck. McQueen: which I guess, we was all there to get our paycheck you knew, you had a job to do and you felt you owed, you know, owed the company a good ••• but you still, IA:- A fair day's work. Yeah, we've heard that from other people, too. MCQueen: We had a lot of privileges, I guess I was fortunate. you know, I mean, I just can't complain. IA: 18: IA:• 18: Well, no, we haven't heard many complaints from people. Actually, we haven't. Not many • We've heard people say they were proud of what the product turned out that they were part of it and they were, the fellowship that was Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 52 and the feeling of being part of something the years and ••• that was ongoing through • IA: How about the area like the Lansing community you lived there, you know, when you were living and working between you worked at the Reo or did you move? '53 and '75, were you living in Lansing the whole time that during the time that at Reo MCQueen: Yeah, I lived in Lansing. IA: In the city. MCQueen: Except for ••• IA: When you were in Florida. McQueen: Well, let's see, in 196., well, no, I went to Florida before I went ••• IA: McQueen: Before. And I lived in town there from '53 to '60 then I moved over here on • st. Joe. the west side, lived on Durant street. out here in ....... Used to live there on the east side and then moved out on We lived there till I moved IA: Okay, so ••• McQueen: Things have changed. IA: Yeah, the community of Lansing itself has changed a lot. McQueen: Boy, you ••••• , you know, •••••••••• there, there wasn't anything out, there was three houses I think in that subdivision and st. Joe was just a little two way street. st. Joe when we moved out IB: Two lane, it was a two lane street. MCQueen: And Creyts Road was all, you know, in fact, they had a murder over there while I lived there. IA: IB: MCQueen: Oh, my goodness. Things have really changed. Ah, huh, and now look at it. really want to move out there in the first place because was way out in the country. It's all built up and just, I didn't I said it • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 53 IS: McQueen: Why out in the country. country right up until, oh, gosh, through the '50s anyway. Waverly Road, from Waverly Road west it was See, when I, when I was, well, when I first started there just up, let's see, it would be just the first farm west of Waverly gone. on Delta River and now, well, the house is gone. The barn's The silo's gone now, too, but I can remember that farm. school, we lived IS: Right there on the corner of Delta River and Waverly? McQueen: Ah, huh. IB: Yes, I, it hasn't been too many years since they took that house and barn and everything. It was just there one day and gone the next. MCQueen: I know it, ah, huh. IB: IA: That was a beautiful farm. What was your maiden name? MCQueen: Shreve • IA: S C H ••• MCQueen: S H REV E. • IB: I'd like to ask about the clubhouse about the office that you worked in. Were they deteriorating, these buildings are so old. just one more time and also The buildings you know, like did you feel like, gosh, were very old. These offices are so old. MCQueen: Of course, they kept them up, you know. IB: Did they? McQueen: Um, hum and, of course, we had all windows little wall space for anything. so really you had very IB: I had heard reports before that the floors in some parts of the complex were, you know, getting weak and had to be sured up and that they didn't put much money back into the building deteriorating. and that it was McQueen: Well, that's true, some parts were worse than others. IA: • office You know, the desks looked like they were up-to-date pretty updated It looked like you had, from the pictures, equipment. all of that looked pretty, fashioned for the time. to us but I know from the time, that was, actually Now it looks a little old I know and Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 54 that it was up-to-date State from 1975 and so it looked, you know, for the, for the time period, were going to ask one more thing about the clubhouse. then because that's what we still have at It seemed like it was adequate. it was good stuff. You IB: Well, I was just thinking same lines, you know, up toward the last, was it beginning shabby or? about the clubhouse itself and along the to look MCQueen: The clubhouse? IB: Urn, hum. MCQueen: Well, yeah, the clubhouse know, and that porch ••• was going downhill. It leaked a lot, you IB: The roof leaked. McQueen: that porch, you know ••• IB: That faced Washington? MCQueen: Ah, huh ••• IB: That was what? McQueen: That got, you know, the roof would leak on that and then, of course, it ruined the inside of the, yeah, it was deteriorating. IB: That's interesting. McQueen: The clubhouse was so, there's so many good memories, know, we all, you know, anybody that worked there could have like weddings and my son's reception was there. and receptions I mean, you IB: Didn't cost you anything to rent the halls so to speak? McQueen: All you had to pay for was the, was the fellow that did the clean up which wasn't very much. IB: IA: IB: IA: Twenty, $25 or something. That's a wonderful service to have for your employees. Gosh yes. 'Cause it must of been a very impressive like that, too. place to hold something • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 55 McQueen: Well, see, they used to have, you probably where they, they used to have the Reo shows there. have heard IA: Oh, yes. McQueen: See, when I was a kid going to school, we'd go Friday afternoon. You know, everybody, the matinee but at night, you had to have parents that worked there so you had to have ticket or whatever all the kids could go on Friday afternoon but ••• to IA: Have a little card or, yeah, I wish I could just see that, the sight of all those kids at the matinee. really something. That would of, must of been McQueen: Well, it was, you know, well, a lot of us would never got to went, go to shows, movies ••• IA: Otherwise. McQueen: And as soon as we'd get out of school, why, boy, we'd all just hike, sometimes we walked all the way and sometimes they would have rides • IB: From the Miller Road area. McQueen: Urn, hum. IA: Going to see the picture show and also live shows, too, you had entertainment shows, too. • MCQueen: 'course that was before I worked there. Well, they had a lot for the employees know, friends that went to school before I did, her dad worked they always could go to all that stuff. go. often I got to go ••••••••• else. took their own •••••••••••• They had five youngsters They took a friend. 'Course they'd But I know one of my at Reo and invite me to so it wasn't very that went on back then, you somebody IA: We've heard from people who snuck in, too, you know. MCQueen: Oh, yeah, that's true. IA: People would sneak in and the guards, way sometimes and ••••••••• I guess, would look the other McQueen: Yeah, it's always been a family, you know, place. • IB: IA: Some time and I don't know where we got the man's name but the man who managed the clubhouse ••• Yeah, we're going to have to find him. Mabe 1 McQueen 6/16/92 Page 56 18: We need to, we're going to have to ••• MCQueen: Vern Haite ••• 18: Pardon me? McQueen: Vern Haite. 18: IA: 18: Vern Haite, that's it. That's right. That's right, and we hope to get to talk to him. MCQueen: He lives out in Williamston, I think. IA: Right. MCQueen: It's Williamston or Webberville. IA: 18: Right. Yeah. McQueen: Yeah, you could get a lot of dope from him. 18: But maybe, what I was thinking thinking of those art, you know, like the ball and the chandelier those things. he might also have some insight into what happened is he might, yeah, true and I was to some and some of MCQueen: You might find some of it out there. IA: Out there, exactly. McQueen: IA: 18: IA: 18: Probably figured it was coming to him. Well, if it was gonna be trashed ••• Why not. happens. that Which sometimes R.E. Olds donated the land and the money for the building downtown, when they tore that down, or didn't tear it down, when they gutted it out to make the office complex about two years ago, things there, chandeliers and just, out into the dump. For instance, the Women's Clubhouse in IA: We were just in there Peter and I. • • • • Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 57 18: IA: 18: IA: 18: IA: 18: • IA: 18: Were you? 'Cause we went in there to do our mortgage the donation plaque, you know, that says this has been donated, been donated by Ransom E. Olds, da, da, da, da, and building's there's are you guys gonna do, 'cause it's just laying on floor. a little saying and stuff and I asked the guy, I said, what a big plaque, this and there's Oh, it was. Yeah, propped up against the wall and I, you know, I said, what are you guys gonna do with that? was nothing. Oh, I don't know, you know, as if it There you go. Gee, I wish they'd donate that to the Museum. They should do, even downtown, Museum. Somewhere. to the state of Michigan Library Some place where people are going to see this. 'Cause as a historian, me sick. when I see something like that, it just makes Urn, hum, me too, and that's what made me sick when I heard, well, for one thing, of course, the clubhouse being torn down, we have two chairs from the clubhouse at the Museum. MCQueen: Oh, do you? 18: IA: MCQueen: • IA: MCQueen: I don't know, obviously, church, I think, on South at some time, maybe when the clubhouse chairs, had 'em for years and.then had enough money, anyway, they called us and they Um, hum, a little church, Pentecostal Cedar, apparently dismantled, you know, that would have been, probably maybe eventually said, we've got these two chairs that are stamped on the bottom property only thing, and visitors and it's as if their childhood couldn't go back. So that's the come in and they all mention the clubhouse home had been torn down and they the old fold up wooden would you like 'em? of Reo Clubhouse, was being Yes! You don't think, the fact that you had such nice memories clubhouse find a place to work later on •••• as a child made any difference of the when you were trying to No, I don't think so • You don't think so. No, at that time, you know ••• Mabel McQueen 6/16/92 Page 58 IA: 18: It was long, it was ancient history. Okay. Well, I don't think I have anything further. Thank you very much. McQueen: Just a minute, I was gonna ••• • • •