Interview of retired Lieutenant Colonel Jean Schiffman on her career in the Army Nurse Corps Ruth Stewart: We are interviewing today Jean Schiffman as a member of the WOSL, San Antonio, Texas unit. This is January the 14th, 2004. Interviewer is Ruth Stewart, assisted by Carol Habgood. [00:21] Jean, start in by telling us a little bit about your early life and what led you into nursing and then the army. Jean Schiffman: Well… Well, I was born and raised in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania; went through, uh, elementary, junior and high school there; and decided I wanted to become a nurse. And uh, went into what we called in those days, nurses' training, at Hahnemann Hospital School of Nursing in Philadelphia. And uh, my completion of a three-year program, I was an RN and went to work in New York at Columbia Presbyterian Medical Center. I worked in the operating room at the Neurological Institute. From there, I went into the army in 1949; and uh, went through basic at Fort Sam. Uh…you want all of my military? Ruth Stewart: Well, let's go back a little bit… Jean Schiffman: Okay. Ruth Stewart: [1:22] …and tell me a little bit what got you interested in nursing; and then why, when you wanted to join the military, why you chose the army. Jean Schiffman: Is there anything else? [laughter] Ruth Stewart: [laughter] Jean Schiffman: Um, in my early years, uh, we were essentially poor; and I had two brothers, a mother and a father. And uh, I don't know, just… I couldn't tell you precisely why I decided to go into nursing, except I always wanted to do that. And uh, incidentally, while I was in Hahnemann, I was in the cadet corps. It came into being during WWII; and, uh, I was a member of the cadet corps for my last two years…two of three years. Um, is that, is that enough about that? Ruth Stewart: It's okay, yeah. Jean Schiffman: And then I, I asked the question, you know, how much of my military history… I'll tell you about… Ruth Stewart: Okay. Jean Schiffman: Uh, I'll go – start with my education first. I was an RN from Hahnemann. In 19, uh, 62, I received my BS from Incarnate Word College here in San Antonio, while I was on active duty. In uh, '66 I received my masters from the University of California, San Francisco Medical Center, uh, still on active duty. And I retired in September of '70. That was 33 years ago. Um, during that time, I had seven years of overseas duty. I had… In 1961 I, uh, spent a year in Korea. And, uh, well, I'd never been camping before. It was quite an experience. But it was sort of interesting because, despite the fact that we had hot weather in the summer and cold weather in the winter, um, I was healthy the whole year. [chuckle] Many people got ill, particularly in the cold weather. Uh, I did bring some pictures showing the type of life we had. We lived in tents with pot belly stoves and… In the OR… Uh, after six months I became OR supervisor there. Me, a young first lieutenant. And uh, for my last six months there I was OR supervisor and also in charge of central materiel. Um, let's see, my next overseas assignment was, uh, in Germany. Ruth Stewart: Before we leave Korea… Jean Schiffman: Yeah. Ruth Stewart: [4:13] …tell us a little bit about your work there as a nurse. Jean Schiffman: It was fantastic. I never knew… As an operating room nurse, I never knew that, uh, technique could be carried out to the extent that it was in Korea, you know, in the field. Our, uh, hospital was a tent, initially. Later, they put it into a frame, but it was a tent with just canvas over the dirt for the floor. Uh, we had a pot belly stove in there. For patients, we had, uh… The stretchers were brought in, we put on horses. We didn't have operating room tables. Our enlisted personnel were really great; and they devised a, uh, an actual scrub sink. They had a big tank outside where they heated water and we could actually scrub with not ice-cold water, uh, for surgery. And I did bring some pictures to show these things. Uh, our living was, uh, really hard. In the wintertime, uh, you'd wake up in your sleeping bag. And uh, we slept on cots with sleeping bags and look up and there were icicles because our pot belly stove… One would be frozen and no heat. Then we didn't want to get out of the sleeping bags because, uh, then we had to go to the latrine – and there’s a picture of that, too. It's a tent where the seats would be frozen. [chuckle] Ruth Stewart: [chuckle] Jean Schiffman: That's – that’s a wild, mad awakening in the morning. Really got you going, though. I’ll tell ya that. Ruth Stewart: I guess. [laughter] Jean Schiffman: And uh, overall, our food was relatively okay. Uh, we ate out of mess kits and uh… I think one thing – like our shower broke down so for six months we strictly were washing out of our helmets. And I think the one thing that, uh, really strikes me is that, uh, you really learn to appreciate the very simple things in life, like being able to take a bath, being in a bed, being able to drink milk. We didn't get… We got that powdered stuff or whatever it was over there. And, uh, there’s a picture there, uh, where I went to Tokyo, uh, to meet a regular army board. I had TDY and, uh, that was like in heaven because I was able to do these things and realize that, you know, what these things – are simple and I'd been missing. Uh, we had, uh, a wonderful… We really had a wonderful group there. It was like one big family. We were out in the field, uh, not near any town or anything like that; but civilians not allowed, except for, uh, we had some young boys cleaning for us and that was about it. Is that enough about Korea? [chuckle] Ruth Stewart: If that's what you want to say, okay. Go on. Jean Schiffman: I think that's enough. Ruth Stewart: Okay. Jean Schiffman: Everybody, uh… We'd work, depending on, uh, the patient load, uh, if we worked 16 hours, 18 hours, until you were ready to flop really. And then, somebody else would take over until they were ready to flop. Ruth Stewart: [7:52] Was there any recreation? Jean Schiffman: Um, well we used to walk in the hills, uh, where they had, uh, seen that there were no land mines. Uh, I did get to go one trip to Seoul, Korea, um, which was… I haven't been there since it's been rebuilt, but all I – I just have memories of how it was. And I did get to actually – I boarded a navy ship… [chuckle] and um, going up the old ladder, Jacob's ladder, which was quite an experience. But that, those were my recreations, actually. Towards the end we did have a club tent and, uh – the end of my stay. But it was nothing. Not much more than just all of us meeting. Ruth Stewart: Mm-hm. Jean Schiffman: Nothing very extravagant. Ruth Stewart: [8:54] And then leaving Korea, what were your feelings about leaving there? Jean Schiffman: Well, actually what happened was, uh, about several weeks before I was supposed to rotate, I received a message from my brother here in the States that my father had died; and the Red Cross had never notified me. I shouldn't say that I hate the Red Cross. I don't hate the Red Cross, but I've always had very ill feelings about the fact that I was never notified. And uh, the chief nurse over there, uh, did make arrangements for me to leave a couple of weeks early, earlier than I was supposed to rotate. Jean Schiffman: Uh, I think my overall feelings about my tour there was, uh, it was, uh, an awakening to, uh, things that I wasn't used to, certainly. And of course, that was true when I was in basic training, too. I'd never lived in a community before; and at that time, we did. We lived in just a big community, but because I was a first lieutenant, I was in a room with just five people rather than 25 people. But uh, it, uh… As I said, I went… I decided to go regular army; and I did. So, I guess I really liked it and wanted to stay in the army. Ruth Stewart: Mm-hm. Jean Schiffman: And uh, after that, uh, let’s see. When I first came back… Isn't that weird, I can't remember where I was assigned when I first came back. I think it was to, uh – yes, it was to Fort Knox. Their old hospital, an old nursing home – nurses’ quarters I should say. Nurse, well – nurses’ quarters. And uh, I lived right above where they shoveled in the soft coal. [chuckle] It's a great experience. Uh, it was a good experience, uh, being back in the States and not going to, uh, a big hospital at that time. I was ready for a small hospital; but I didn't stay there long. Uh, I did get transferred to, uh, Aberdeen Proving Ground. And, uh, that was an experience inasmuch as there were just two operating room nurses, and we also took care of OB – like delivery room and all this good stuff. Plus, they were shooting off all these guns. I felt like I was back in the old country. [chuckle] Um, but that was short lived also. I then went to Valley Forge. This was all in a short period of time, because in 19, uh, 62, I had orders for Germany. And, uh, I went to Landstuhl, Germany. You hear about Landstuhl now, but, uh, patients going through there coming back to the States. I spent two years there in the operating room. And I could have rotated then, but I had the opportunity to go to a, uh, become the chief nurse of the field unit outside of Frankfurt. So, I lived in Frankfurt for a year and I was with the 31st Surgical Hospital. I came back in '58 and, uh, to Brooke Army Medical Center. And I spent four years at Brooke here, uh, only because I asked to, uh, be left here so that I could finish my BS program [inaudible 13:00]. And what I did was I worked light duty in the operating room; and took classes during the day; and carried mostly nine hours. So, I was meeting myself coming and going. And I used to type, uh, not type…tape, excuse me, tape my lectures and reference work and then, while I was sleeping, I'd play’m. [chuckle] My mother was with me then and it drove her sort of wild. But uh… Then in '60, I had to have uh, surgery; and I'm still going to school and at that… So, I just took one course that semester and it was a microbiology. Everyone says, “Microbiology? Wow." So, the night before my surgery, the day before my surgery, uh, I went into, uh, for my mid-term; then I had my surgery and I went on convalescent leave and, uh, my kid brother was stationed in Bermuda with the coast guard. So, I went over there for my convalescent leave; came back and, uh, got on A in microbiology. I graduated in, uh, let's see…I think I got the years messed up. Yeah, in '62 I graduated magna cum laude, despite working and going to school and all that. Hard work… Ruth Stewart: That's terrific Jean Schiffman: And immediately I got orders for Japan. So, I took my mother and our cocker spaniel, and we went to Japan. And uh, it was great. You know, we were in the housing area; had a full-time maid. I was in charge of the operating room and central supply; and I learned how to play duplicate bridge and, uh, learned to golf while I was there. That was my country club assignment. And uh, put in for graduate school and, uh, came back and went to graduate school for just one year and got my MS. Um, from there I went to, uh, South Carolina. I can't even think of the name of the place. At any rate, from there I went to Fort Benning, and I taught operating room nursing until I retired in '70. That's the end of my military career. Ruth Stewart: [15:34] In teaching operating room nursing, you were working with graduate nurses that were already in the army? Jean Schiffman: I was working with lieutenants and captains, yes. And actually, that was when Vietnam was going on; and they'd finish my program; and they'd go over, but I never went over. It was, uh, an interesting program, and, uh, nice, young, eager students. It was very nice. Ruth Stewart: Mm-hm. [16:04] Did you like the teaching? Jean Schiffman: Yes, I did. Ruth Stewart; Mm-hm. Jean Schiffman: I was ready for it, I think. And uh, with my years of operating room experience, plus my education, I, I think I was pretty well qualified for it. What else can I tell you? My afterlife? [chuckle] Ruth Stewart: [16:28] Well, before we get to that, what are your major memories of your career? Jean Schiffman: Oh, I don't know. I, I didn't mention, I don't believe, that in basic I had gone to, uh, Letterman out in San Francisco. And uh, that was my, uh, first time out on the west coast. And a group of four of us drove out… It was sort of interesting – in this clunky old Ford that was about ready to fall apart. But we were going from basic to Letterman. We got to Letterman and the car looked around and said, "That's all." It saw the hills and said, "That's all." [chuckle] Uh, that was a great experience; and I, I've loved that area ever since, actually. But I was there just for about a year and, uh, then I went to graduate school there. And then after I retired, I lived in the hills of Oakland for three years Ruth Stewart: [17:22] So you had a little experience in that area then? Jean Schiffman: Yeah. And I, you know, Korea was a certainly a highlight, uh, that taught me an awful lot. As a young person, a young nurse, I think I – that was my greatest learning experience in the army. The rest was fine. I mean, I really did enjoy my army career. Ruth Stewart: [17:53] And do you have any, um… Do you – your experience as being, uh, caring for combatants and working in the military through a war, uh, did that affect your view of war in any way? Jean Schiffman: Well, if I, you don't mind my saying so, war is hell no matter how you look at. And uh, you know, very little is said about, uh, what happened in Korea. Uh, we hear about Vietnam, Vietnam; and of course, now, uh, Iraq. Um, Korea was a hard time and actually, it's, it’s something that, uh, never ended. We still have troops there. Uh, there's still, uh, I don't know. How do I feel about war time in general? I, I think it's… I don't know. There has to be a better way, but war has always been in our history and I guess it always will be. Ruth Stewart: [18:55] Since your retirement, have you joined veteran’s organizations aside from… Jean Schiffman: I belong to the American Legion, yeah. Other organizations I've joined have to do with my, uh, loss of vision. Ruth Stewart: [19:16] Tell us a little bit about that. Jean Schiffman: About my loss of vision? Ruth Stewart: Mm-hm. Jean Schiffman: Well, I guess they call it, uh, macular degeneration. And it's where the macula is the most acute, uh, vision spot in the retina. I don't want to get too technical but, um, there are two types. There's wet and dry. And I have – I'm unfortunate enough to have the wet type, which 10 percent are wet, and 90 percent are dry. The wet, uh, you actually hemorrhage in the back of your eye; and it obscures your central vision – and the macula. And so, I have peripheral vision. I can see around the sides, top and bottom, but if I look at something, I can't read it. If I look at you, your face isn't clear. Ruth Stewart: [20:06] You've done some major adaptation though, to improve your living with this or as… Jean Schiffman: Up to a talking computer [chuckle] and uh, my, uh, closed-circuit TVs and, uh, talking books. And what else? I don't know, I have all kinds of things. I never go without. This is a 9-power magnifier so that I can read this if I try to. Ruth Stewart: Mm-hm. Jean Schiffman: Uh… Ruth Stewart: [20:40] That didn't have anything to do with your military career, did it? Jean Schiffman: No, it was genetic. It had to do with my age and genetics. Yeah, I think… You know, my mother was never diagnosed with macular degeneration, but when I think back… She died in '79. Uh, she had an eye problem and it got to the point where, uh, she didn't read. She'd watch TV, but she still played cards. She taught me how to play bridge when I was this big. And uh, but I think that she probably had macular degeneration. So, I think maybe it was a genetic thing. Ruth Stewart: Mm-hm. Well, you certainly had a notable career as an army nurse. And we appreciate you sharing this information with us. Jean Schiffman: Well, I hope it was adequate. And uh, but that's my life. Ruth Stewart: Thank you very much. /al